'Ayman Al-Gilmore "a former Official Sinn féin sticky, Workers Party, Democratic Left and now New Labour says these things with the backing of the pro-unionist Fine Gael and can't represent the views of the Irish people in this instance. The IRA campaign rose out of necessity - and continued through popular support among a section of the Nationalist people - the Irish Government could have done much more to facilitate them but didn't - and many of the states forces lost their lives or limbs in the endeavour.
A some point the 'Troubles' have to put in the past - this constant need to rake everything up with endless Inquiries and reports leaves vitriol current a line, at some point will have to be drawn over yet another dark period in our history.
Gilmore cannot allow the unionists to rewrite history to cover up the reasons for the troubles and how they played out.]
Could Dublin have done more to defeat IRA campaign?
A sense that republicans have been more effective in rewriting the history is at the heart of unionist disquiet
The IRA was also a major threat to the Irish State. Although it prohibited attacks on members of the Irish security forces, its activities in the Republic, from bank robberies and kidnappings, to prison breaks and assassinations, demanded tough action from the State and led to a state of day-to-day antagonism between Garda and IRA members.
However, there were major political obstacles to being seen to help the security forces in the North. They were spelt out by Paddy Donegan, the minister for defence in the coalition government, in conversation with the British ambassador in 1973.
Donegan was a bitter opponent of the IRA and favourably disposed to doing as much as he could to improve co-operation, but emphasised the need “for absolute secrecy and discretion” which stemmed from “the age-old instinctive feeling on the part of most Irishmen that it was a bad thing for Irishmen to co-operate with the British in clobbering fellow Irishmen, however rascally the latter might be”.
Successive governments faced a dilemma. By co-operating with the RUC and British army against republicans, there was a risk of reigniting latent republican sentiment in a State with a nationalist ethos at its core.
At the same time the IRA had the expressed aim of overthrowing the Irish State and its activities were an ongoing threat to the authority and legitimacy of Government and the Dáil.
The dilemma was often resolved by a highly politicised approach to cross-Border co-operation. Areas such as extradition and direct contact between the Irish security forces and the British army in areas such as South Armagh, both of which could have contributed significantly to curbing the IRA, were effectively no-go areas throughout the Troubles .
Individual personalitiesCo-operation on the ground in Border areas was often good but was often reliant on the personalities of individual policemen and what was perceived to be the attitude of Minister of Justice and government of the day.
The role of the Irish State during the Troubles is more than an idée fixe of unionists, it is a question of major historical importance with a central bearing on any process of dealing with the past. While the Saville Tribunal’s inquiry into Bloody Sunday cannot act as a template for any broader mechanism for dealing with the past, it did demonstrate the immense value of a state making the vast majority of its records open for scrutiny.
To build on Eamon Gilmore’s speech, the Irish Government should consider opening the State archives on these contentious issues in as comprehensive a manner as Saville. This would not end the battle over history in Northern Ireland but it would at least cut down on the amount of permissible lies about the past.
Prof Henry Patterson is a professor of politics in the University of Ulster and recently published Ireland’s Violent Frontier: The Border and Anglo-Irish Relations During the Troubles.
( Palgrave-Macmillan 2013)
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But from the start of Unionism the fear has been that those who labelled themselves as unionist was that any Irish state would have no respect for their religion (which turned out to be true), would be corrupt (which turned out to be true), would be repressive and reactionary (which turned out to be true) and would fail economically (which also turned out to be true), the reality of the state created by Catholics was worse than the worse Rome Rule state they feared.
What did the nationalist side ever do to try understand the unionists especially the hundreds of thousands of working class ones who weren't Anglo Irish landlords.
I am anything but an admirer of Paddy Donnegan but the quote in the article attributed to him rings true and is a fair reflection of attitudes in the South during the 1970's in particular and illustrates to anyone who wasn't old enough during those times to understand why it wasn't possible for the Dublin government to act in any other way even if it had the will to do so.
While it has always been suggested that all communication between MI6 and the IRA leadership (before/during and after the hunger strikes) was passed through a Derry based ‘middleman’ a communication between MI6 Agent Michael Oatley and Martin McGuinness (1993), reproduced here and published publicly for the first time, shows that there was a very direct line of communication between Martin McGuinness and MI6, however, this particular line of communication between McGuinness and MI6 suggests that Martin McGuinness was an xxxxx rather than a negotiator on behalf of the Provisional IRA or Sinn Fein. This assertion can be made, as Oatley was not part of the MI5 lead negotiating team that was engaged with the IRA leadership in 1993, Oatley had been replaced by a senior MI5 Officer, John Deverill, both Oatley and John Deverill had at all times been advised by former IRA Commander/MI5 Agent Sean O’Callaghan, hence, Oatley’s use of the Irish language in his communication to McGuinness.
Dealings between the IRA and MI6 go back to the early 1970’s when the intelligence agency operated out of a house in Hollywood, Co Down known as Laneside. In 1974 and 1975 a Foreign Office diplomat, James Allen and a senior MI6 Agent, Michael Oatley regularly met IRA leaders there during what became known as “the Feakle ceasefire”, from this time forward many Senior IRA activists such as xxxxxxx were groomed by M16.
The UDA's/UFF's declared goal was to defend Protestant loyalist areas and to combat Irish republicanism, particularly the Provisional IRA. However, most of its victims were unarmed civilians according to the Sutton Index of Deaths. The majority of them were Irish Catholics killed in what the group called retaliation for attacks on Protestants. High-profile attacks carried out by the group include the Milltown massacre, the Sean Graham bookmakers' shooting, the Castlerock killings and the Greysteel massacre. The vast majority of its attacks were in Northern Ireland, but from 1972 onward it also carried out bombings in the Republic of Ireland.
only an idiot or fascist would extrapolate that pockets of support in belfast and derry is justification for an organisation to attempt the violent overthrow of two states and install its leaders as the government of the entire people of Ireland - all against the will of the majority of people in ireland.
the uncomfortable fact for ira apologists as they attempt to rewrite the armed struggle in the public's imagination as a mass movement of the people is that more than 66 per cent of catholics in the north never supported it, and an ever greater number in the south were opposed to it.
True, with some reservations about "major" and "central bearing." However, to deal properly with the past, we need real agreement in the present, agreement that seems farther away each marching season. Some people in Ireland's far south can be woefully ignorant of the far north, and learn some of their history from ballads and from politicians. It's hard for them to understand that the Unionists of NI didn't just get off a boat yesterday. It's hard, too, for younger people to understand those of us who saw fine, dacent shop owners, who made their living in the Republic, cross the border at night, put on a B Special uniform, and harass their neighbours who dared to be on the NI roads at night. But we're prepared to move on.
Too many Unionists are not prepared to move on, and their complaints, however legitimate otherwise, are discounted by their continued insistence on entitlement to own and to rule. Until they are prepared to share their sand-box a bit more cheerfully, they will get little sympathy from some quarters.
Perhaps Prof. Patterson will launch a "let's educate the yobbos" campaign--or maybe he has.
Their inability to see this and join forces with their similarly dispossessed working-class Catholic neighbours and march and work together for a better society for their children is the most pessimistic thing about the North.
Leaders there have grown rich fostering the sectarianism for generations.
Waken up all of you to who the real enemy is and do something about it.
If this statement is not itself revisionist then I don't know what is..
A Chara
I hope this communication finds you well since our last meeting, needless to say that the National Chairman is unhappy with recent high profile events both here on the mainland and in your locality. The National Chairman is finding it difficult to sell any part of our discussion to the National Executive. Recent headline events are unfortunate to say the least and slow down any forward movement in the immediate future. I don’t need to emphasis the importance of restraining headline events such as those we have witnessed over recent months. While both the National and Local Chairmen understand the need for you to retain your position, further, high profile events will continue to undermine our work.
Martin I hope you don’t mind if I conclude by giving a new meaning to Tiocfaidh ár lá.
Is Mise
Michael Oatley
There are a innumerable people guilty of keeping the six counties in strife for 30 years and they were not all in the IRA.
There are more than two sets of liars on this subject.
The best quote I've heard about aftermath of the NI Peace Process is that "Republicans were too clever to admit they had lost and unionists were too stupid to realise they had won." Kind of sums it up for me.
A some point the 'Troubles' have to put in the past - this constant need to rake everything up with endless Inquiries and reports leaves vitriol current a line, at some point will have to be drawn over yet another dark period in our history.
Gilmore cannot allow the unionists to rewrite history to cover up the reasons for the troubles and how they played out.
utter lies. less than a third of northern catholics - the supposed "community" the IRA were fighting for, ever supported the IRA during their campaign. The percentage of support south of the border was even more paltry. what popular support?
The tricky wordplay is telling. "...continued through popular support among a section of the Nationalist people". so if 1 per cent of nationalists had supported it, that would equate to popular support among a "section" of the nationalist people. 10 people could be considered a "section" of the nationalist population. you're engaged in mealy-mouthed obfuscation, like most ira propagandists.
@Brendan O'Brien:
"Nationalist don't want unity they never have, they want superiority, that's what nationalism is all about, exceptionalism."
you've hit the nail on the head. the campaign for a united Ireland, which has no popular support north or south of the border, is simply a matter of revenge. northern republicans want to turn the tables on unionists and force them to surrender. that's all it's about. even the majority of catholics north of the border don't want a united Ireland anymore, it's simply the bugbear of a few blockheads with triumphalist aspirations.
I've read the contribution - you use ambiguous language wilfully, like all ira apologists and propagandists I've encountered.
absolutely any organisation, no matter how marginal, could claim to have legitimacy based on popular support using the definition of popular support you use.
Whistleblowing ‘Guantanamo granny’ back in court
Margaretta D'Arcy and Nial Farrel outside Ennis Court
Because of the nature and possibly seriousness of the charges, Judge Durkan had mentioned at the previous hearing on 10 July that issues of jurisdiction arose in the case, so there was a question of whether the case would be referred to the higher Circuit Court level. Judge Durkan announced on Wednesday that the DPP had decided that the case/cases should be dealt with at the lower District Court level, and he also announced that he, Judge Durkan had decided that he himself would also accept jurisdiction over the cases. This seemed to indicate that the State wished to play down the importance of the cases, perhaps to ensure the matters get as little publicity as possible.
It was also noticeable at the hearing that the Judge and the Gardai adopted a very tolerant approach to the defendants in spite of the manner of their dress in court that at times included Niall Farrell wearing an Obama mask, and in spite of what could be termed "political" type remarks by the defendants. Judge initially said he wished to deal with the cases and the charges separately, but eventually he agree to consider them all together.
Since the last hearing on 10 July when the same Judge was considering the alleged offences of Margaretta D'Arcy and Niall Farrell being on the main runway at Shannon airport on 7 October 2012, Margaretta and Niall were once again arrested on the same main runway at Shannon airport on 1 September 2013. Their reasons for this second incursion on to the runway included the fact that the "improper" use of Shannon airport by the US military and CIA that they had been protesting in 2012 was still going on, and the possibility of a US military attack on Syria being facilitated by Shannon airport obliged them to once again highlight this improper use of the main runway at Shannon airport.
Inspector Kennedy stated that Garda witnesses in these cases included Garda O'Connor and Garda Sergeant Michael O'Connor. He said that Garda statements and papers in this case were still being compiled and he suggested adjourning the cases until 2nd October 2013. It was not clear whether this was an adjournment for mention and setting a future date for trial, or if the trial was to go ahead on 2nd of October. From previous experiences it is most likely that the 2nd October hearing is for mention only and dealing with preliminary matters. Niall Farrell asked for a Garry Doyle order whereby the State's witness statements and other case papers would be made available to the defence and this was agreed.
Niall Farrell said that they had not committed any offence and that their actions were acts of humanity highlighting crimes against humanity. He was ordered to sit down and remain silent by the judge who said that otherwise he would be removed from the court. Niall then said that the public and the all the people of Ireland had blood on their hands as a result of the actions of our Government at Shannon airport. Niall was then removed from the court and as he was being removed he put on his Obama mask. As Niall was being removed from the court he said loudly: "you can remove me from the court but you can't remove the blood that stains Shannon airport and the hands of the Irish people."
Margaretta D'Arcy said that their actions were the actions of whistle-blowers, and she then took a whistle out of her pocket and blew the whistle loudly in the court-room.She stated “I am a whistle blower and I witnessed the build-up of the USA warmongers to the invasion of Syria last weekend at Shannon. The Irish Government are complicit in this threatened illegal invasion by aiding and abetting the warmongers at Shannon The people of the World have said No to WAR.”
This action did not seem to incur the same reaction from the Judge as he had reacted to Niall Farrell's remarks. Margaretta emphasised that actions were to expose the crimes against humanity being facilitated by US warplanes at Shannon, and she stated that over the past week, there were increased number of such warplanes at Shannon.
The hearing ended quickly just before lunchtime, when Inspector Kennedy and Judge Durcan agree that the hearing be adjourned until 2 October. When Margaretta attempted to make further remarks the Judge called for the next case, and the defendants and their supporters retired to a local hostelry for a well-deserved lunch.
It should be noted perhaps that the judges at Nuremberg were succinct when they stated that: "Individual citizens have the duty to violate domestic laws to prevent crimes against peace and humanity." Margaretta and Niall strongly believe that the ordinary people of Syria, and countless others, and their own self-respect, deserve nothing less now.
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Jump To Comment: 1 2 3 4 5Al Qaeda AirForce Out Of Shannon Ireland NOW!
AL QAEDA AIRFORCE OUT OF SHANNON
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'The text in the several sections indicated below, parts of which were written by international political analyst, researcher and consultant Adrian Salbuchi, was used as the message-text in an e-mail sent last Thursday afternoon (September 12th 2013) to the United Nations titled:
" ... global criminals gone berserk ..."'
=== === ===
Yesterday morning, September 13th 2013, the earlier mentioned message-text (i.e. the same message-text as that used for the September 12th 2013 UN e-mail) was sent to Colette Nolan who is the Chief Executive Officer of the Republic of Ireland's Irish Advocacy Network. A full copy of the e-mail used, which was copied to several of her work colleagues (using the same e-mail), can be viewed at:
http://www.humanrightsireland.com/ColetteNolanCEOofIris...l.htm
An e-mail containing the same above-mentioned UN message-text was also sent yesterday (September 13th 2013) to the British Monarchy, and to a selection of UK Members of the House of Commons, and the House of Lords. A full copy of the e-mail used can be viewed at:
http://www.humanrightsireland.com/BritishMonarchy/13Sep...l.htm
In addition, and also sent yesterday, an e-mail was dispatched to an international Group of MEPs (Members of the European Parliament) which also featured the same above-mentioned UN message-text (of September 12th 2013):
http://www.humanrightsireland.com/MEPs/13September2013/...l.htm
=== === ===
Related Link:
"United Nations, government corruption, crime, cover ups, IMPUNITY, Human Rights Ireland ..."
http://tinyurl.com/ojwc84l
By Agence France-Presse
Friday, September 13, 2013 6:28 EDT
An image provided by SITE Intelligence Group on February 12, 2012 shows al-Qaeda chief Ayman
Topics: ayman ♦ Site Intelligence Group
21
Al-Qaeda chief Ayman, in a speech marking the 12th anniversary of 9/11, called for attacks on the United States and a boycott of the world’s largest economy.
A summary and translated English excerpts of the roughly 72-minute address was made available by the SITE Intelligence Group.
The speech was posted on jihadi forums a day after America held ceremonies in honor of the nearly 3,000 people killed in the attacks of September 11, 2001.
“We should bleed America economically by provoking it to continue in its massive expenditure on its security, for the weak point of America is its economy, which has already begun to stagger due to the military and security expenditure,” Zawahiri said according to the SITE translation.
“And keeping America in tension and anticipation only costs a few disparate attacks here and there, meaning as we defeated it in the gang warfare in Somalia, Yemen, Iraq and Afghanistan, so we should follow it with that war on its own land,” he added.
Aymani went on to say that these strikes could be “done by one brother or a few of the brothers” and that it was worth waiting for the right moment in order to mount a large-scale attack.
“With these strikes, we must monitor and lie in wait and seize any opportunity to land a large strike on it, even if it takes years of patience for this,” he said.
Aymani also referenced the twin bomb blasts at the Boston marathon in April that left three dead and scores wounded and maimed.
“The Boston incident confirms to the Americans the extent of their lying and tricking of themselves, and their arrogance from accepting the truth that is as bright as the sun, which is that they are not facing individuals, organizations or groups, but they are facing an uprising Ummah [Muslim community], that rose in jihad to defend its soul, dignity and capabilities,” he said.
According to the SITE summary, Ayman also urged jihadists in war-torn Syria not to cooperate with Protestants."
Ayman
"Al-Qaeda chief Ayman calls for U.S. attacks and economic boycott ...": http://tinyurl.com/q44e8u2
Al-Qaida chief Ayman al-Zawahiri: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayman_al-Zawahiri
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Article 28.3.1 of Bunreacht na hEireann (constitution of the Republic of Ireland): "War shall not be declared and the State shall not participate in any war save with the assent of Dáil Éireann."
The excerpt (the part in quotes) just above has come from: http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/en/constitution/index.html
I'm not sure if our State (Republic of Ireland) ever did get the "assent of Dáil Éireann" -- for "participating" -- in the ILLEGAL (under international law) invasion of Iraq, for example? It would be VERY strange if they did: allowing for the well-known illegality of that particularly nasty piece of outrageous "Bush/Blair" CRIME which has already cost the lives of hundreds of thousands of people (and possibly millions according to some reports).
Personally, I would not be in the SLIGHTEST bit surprised if our State didn't get the necessary -- required by law -- assent.
Much more likely -- I suspect (???) -- that our lily-livered, greed-and-corruption ridden, and grossly ignorant, Dáil Éireann occupants would have UNLAWFULLY caved into one or other of the George W. Bush's crime-ridden type mantras? Such as (for example):
"All those who fail to 100% support our 'war on terror efforts' (so called!!) will be treated as the arch-enemies of the United States of America".
and/or:
The constitution "is just a goddamned piece of paper" and "don't anybody EVER talk to ME -- GEORGE W BUSH -- about it being the SUPREME LAW of the land, and all of that very silly and COMPLETELY OUTDATED verbal rubbish and nonsense" (or words to that effect).
"Do you NOT know who I, GEORGE W BUSH am? Do you not realise that, among MANY other things, I can walk on water, catch and stop bullets with my teeth, and -- far better than ANYTHING Christ could EVER do -- that I can even shit ice-cream (for example): so mind what you say in my presence!!".
"Know what I mean 'Arry"?
Related Link #1:
"The Constitution is just "a goddamned piece of paper", Human Rights Ireland ..."
http://tinyurl.com/omc75b7
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Related Link #2:
"War on terror, Shannon Airport, Article 28.3.1 of Bunreacht na hEireann, Constitution of the Republic of Ireland ..."
http://tinyurl.com/q7b3w45